South Dakota Voices Response: Nathan, thank you for joining the conversation. Perhaps I did not convey the problem clearly. The issue is corporations are taking advantage of the foreign workers and the taxpayers. In the past corporations were required to cover the full cost of foreign workers that they brought into the country including housing, food, transportation, medical care, etc. Today, corporations are bringing these workers in without covering anything, depressing wages for everyone, and transferring the costs associated with paying lower than survival wages to the taxpayers. This is not good for anyone other than the corporation. The foreign worker is basically an indentured servant, because he/she cannot change jobs and keep his/her visa (a kind of modern day slavery). Citizens who were above the poverty line are now below the poverty line because of depressed wages (stagnant wages are depressed wages with a real inflation of 8-14% -- what we have been seeing since the late 1990s, shadowstats.com discusses the adjustment that Michael Boskin made to hide the real inflation numbers) and the everyone else has a higher tax burden to cover the people that can't make it on their own. About the religious element, I am not aware of any religion that suggests we should be putting people into a quasi-slavery (indentured servitude) situation or allowing a few people to take advantage of others under the guise of something good.
Email comment from NO: "I would recommend you drop your Eurocentric views towards how refugees are a problem. How many South Dakotans originated from immigrants that came to this country to work and make a better living. This country was built on the backs of immigrants/slaves. So, for you to all of a sudden want to turn your backs on the things that allowed you to be here (or is the reason you are here) seems to be a little hypocritical. If you want to want to attack how cooperations, for hundreds of years, have been using government to financial line their pockets, while creating work force insecurity, then that is a talk that needs to be had. However, don’t try to hide your libertarian/nationalist views in there to drum support for the ongoing victimization of immigrants, who only want a better life. Most of the time fleeing from situations that were created by the United States backing of dictatorships in the 50’s-90’s, all in the name of capitalism. Your solutions only promote a culturalist/nationalist view that, if you are a religious person of any sort, flies in the face of your makers teachings. "
"Immigrants are obliged to respect with gratitude the material and spiritual heritage of the country that receives them, to obey its laws and to assist in carrying civic burdens." [Catholic Catechism, 2241.]
The mud men and mud women from Africa are not doing this in South Dakota
South Dakota Voices Response: Gary, thank you for joining the conversation. From an economic perspective, consumption taxes are the least distortionary. Many people are talking about the important of cutting the corporate welfare, so less taxes are necessary.
Email comment from GE: "Income tax is the fairest method. Adjustments would need to be made to both property and sales tax."
Um, NO. Sales tax unfairly impacts the poor, since we still tax necessities like food, fuel, utilities... Where as property taxes are more proportional to wealth.
Thank you for joining the conversation. Most people agree the best solution is to stop the corporate welfare (including TIFs) so people are not so financially burdened. From an economic perspective consumption taxes (sales taxes) are the least distortionary. Property taxes are some of the most distortionary taxes.
Again, NO, consumption (sales) taxes are actually HIGHLY "distortionary." Sales/consumption taxes take a far greater percentage of income from the poor end of the spectrum and a lower percentage of income from the rich. Property taxes (based on the proportional value of homes/property are far more equitable (lower income have smaller lower value homes vs higher income have high value homes). Stick to property taxes or a fair flat rate income tax that doesn't inequitably burden the poor.
First lets deal with the lie that economic development is lining the pockets of big corporations, spoken like a true socialist I must say. It is attracting businesses to the state by giving them incentives to build here, all states do this in some form or another. This will raise the tax base.
Now for the workers fallacy. It is basic supply and demand. The fewer people for jobs the more wages will go up to attract the best from a smaller pool of workers. That is how it works. Then there is the fact that people are not glued to the ground they were born on. If wages in SD go up then more experienced workers will do a thing called move. Yes, people can move all over the country, have been for decades. Now that we have more people with better pay there will be more tax money for roads and bridges.
Forgien workers? Are you talking about green cards and workers visa's? These people have to have a sponsor so they have a verified job. They are mostly agricultural workers and clerks not the type that take on more skilled work. Yeah, I have been to the Black Hills and have seen all the forgien workers during tourist season. News flash, they get paid the same as an American, they have to be it is the law. What are you talking about?
Real inflation is down to 3.8 last I looked, you are quoting FJB's insane inflation, that the dems told us was our imagination, from a year ago. What are you talking about?
None of the forgien worker I have worked with brought their children, that is not how the forgien worker system operates. What are you talking about?
This whole point is just fear mongering and xenophobic. Give it a rest.
Keep the office of economic prosperity open so we can all have better pay.
Thank you for sharing your viewpoints. I am using the real inflation. The calculation is included in the link (shadowstats.com provides the adjustment to the method that was used before Michael Boskin changed to the substitution method of calculating inflation). Actually, in capitalistic terms economic development is a socialistic construct. In economics there is always a deadweight loss when the government is involved. Perhaps you could share your calculation on the tax base. In SD, when you pull people below the poverty line you they can’t buy things and you can’t collect tax. In my opinion, this is one of the big problems with economic development charts. They don’t focus on what happens in the whole economy.
2015 to 2025 - - From 2015 to 2025, the US average inflation rate, measured by the Consumer Price Index (CPI), has fluctuated, with notable increases in 2021 and 2022, and a recent decrease to 2.9% in 2024.
Thank you for the comment. Michael Boskin developed a technique to hide inflation in the 1980s and 1990s. In general terms you add about 7% to the reported rates to get the actual rate. You can find all the details here. https://southdakotavoices.substack.com/p/real-inflation-a-real-worry
You are correct, cutting corporate welfare to reduce the burden on middle and lower income people (where most of it is borne) is the most effective tax measure.
Some corporate incentives are good for the public, I agree they can be overdone to a degree of corporate welfare that is bad deal for all but the particular corp. However, my original comment was disagreeing your comment that sales tax was more fair than property tax.
Vince is correct. We are located in South Dakota, but use the Substack writing platform. It is located in San Francisco and they put their address on everything. We would be happy to use a South Dakota product, but have not found anything equivalent.
I think it is because substack is a west coast based publishing app. There exist no publishing apps in S Dakota. It would be the same thing as if someone was using gmail. Just because someone might have a gmail account does not mean they are in California.
I know an area in Mexico where many cars have South Dakota license plates, they have South Dakota drivers license . They have never lived here nor do they intend to. Their car insurance is cheaper and South Dakotas taxes for registrations are cheaper. They just go on line and register and no one checks it out.
Sally thank you for letting us know. I believe South Dakota Canvassing, the nonpartisan voting integrity group, is working on this problem. I am not sure they solved the plate or driver's license issue, but I think they might have made some progress in stopping these people from voting in our elections. If you haven't already contacted them with this information, I am sure they would grateful to receive it. @southdakotacanvassinggroup
South Dakota Voices Response: Nathan, thank you for joining the conversation. Perhaps I did not convey the problem clearly. The issue is corporations are taking advantage of the foreign workers and the taxpayers. In the past corporations were required to cover the full cost of foreign workers that they brought into the country including housing, food, transportation, medical care, etc. Today, corporations are bringing these workers in without covering anything, depressing wages for everyone, and transferring the costs associated with paying lower than survival wages to the taxpayers. This is not good for anyone other than the corporation. The foreign worker is basically an indentured servant, because he/she cannot change jobs and keep his/her visa (a kind of modern day slavery). Citizens who were above the poverty line are now below the poverty line because of depressed wages (stagnant wages are depressed wages with a real inflation of 8-14% -- what we have been seeing since the late 1990s, shadowstats.com discusses the adjustment that Michael Boskin made to hide the real inflation numbers) and the everyone else has a higher tax burden to cover the people that can't make it on their own. About the religious element, I am not aware of any religion that suggests we should be putting people into a quasi-slavery (indentured servitude) situation or allowing a few people to take advantage of others under the guise of something good.
Email comment from NO: "I would recommend you drop your Eurocentric views towards how refugees are a problem. How many South Dakotans originated from immigrants that came to this country to work and make a better living. This country was built on the backs of immigrants/slaves. So, for you to all of a sudden want to turn your backs on the things that allowed you to be here (or is the reason you are here) seems to be a little hypocritical. If you want to want to attack how cooperations, for hundreds of years, have been using government to financial line their pockets, while creating work force insecurity, then that is a talk that needs to be had. However, don’t try to hide your libertarian/nationalist views in there to drum support for the ongoing victimization of immigrants, who only want a better life. Most of the time fleeing from situations that were created by the United States backing of dictatorships in the 50’s-90’s, all in the name of capitalism. Your solutions only promote a culturalist/nationalist view that, if you are a religious person of any sort, flies in the face of your makers teachings. "
Hey Nathan:
"Immigrants are obliged to respect with gratitude the material and spiritual heritage of the country that receives them, to obey its laws and to assist in carrying civic burdens." [Catholic Catechism, 2241.]
The mud men and mud women from Africa are not doing this in South Dakota
https://voxday.net/2018/12/22/a-nation-of-immigrants/
If this goes away what will happen to the Bill Zortman show? That is the majority of his guests and show content coming from this government grift.
It is worth trying it out.
South Dakota Voices Response: Gary, thank you for joining the conversation. From an economic perspective, consumption taxes are the least distortionary. Many people are talking about the important of cutting the corporate welfare, so less taxes are necessary.
Email comment from GE: "Income tax is the fairest method. Adjustments would need to be made to both property and sales tax."
Um, NO. Sales tax unfairly impacts the poor, since we still tax necessities like food, fuel, utilities... Where as property taxes are more proportional to wealth.
Thank you for joining the conversation. Most people agree the best solution is to stop the corporate welfare (including TIFs) so people are not so financially burdened. From an economic perspective consumption taxes (sales taxes) are the least distortionary. Property taxes are some of the most distortionary taxes.
Again, NO, consumption (sales) taxes are actually HIGHLY "distortionary." Sales/consumption taxes take a far greater percentage of income from the poor end of the spectrum and a lower percentage of income from the rich. Property taxes (based on the proportional value of homes/property are far more equitable (lower income have smaller lower value homes vs higher income have high value homes). Stick to property taxes or a fair flat rate income tax that doesn't inequitably burden the poor.
I'm a NO on any tax increase, particularly sales tax which puts the burden of collection on us unpaid retailers.
First lets deal with the lie that economic development is lining the pockets of big corporations, spoken like a true socialist I must say. It is attracting businesses to the state by giving them incentives to build here, all states do this in some form or another. This will raise the tax base.
Now for the workers fallacy. It is basic supply and demand. The fewer people for jobs the more wages will go up to attract the best from a smaller pool of workers. That is how it works. Then there is the fact that people are not glued to the ground they were born on. If wages in SD go up then more experienced workers will do a thing called move. Yes, people can move all over the country, have been for decades. Now that we have more people with better pay there will be more tax money for roads and bridges.
Forgien workers? Are you talking about green cards and workers visa's? These people have to have a sponsor so they have a verified job. They are mostly agricultural workers and clerks not the type that take on more skilled work. Yeah, I have been to the Black Hills and have seen all the forgien workers during tourist season. News flash, they get paid the same as an American, they have to be it is the law. What are you talking about?
Real inflation is down to 3.8 last I looked, you are quoting FJB's insane inflation, that the dems told us was our imagination, from a year ago. What are you talking about?
None of the forgien worker I have worked with brought their children, that is not how the forgien worker system operates. What are you talking about?
This whole point is just fear mongering and xenophobic. Give it a rest.
Keep the office of economic prosperity open so we can all have better pay.
Thank you for sharing your viewpoints. I am using the real inflation. The calculation is included in the link (shadowstats.com provides the adjustment to the method that was used before Michael Boskin changed to the substitution method of calculating inflation). Actually, in capitalistic terms economic development is a socialistic construct. In economics there is always a deadweight loss when the government is involved. Perhaps you could share your calculation on the tax base. In SD, when you pull people below the poverty line you they can’t buy things and you can’t collect tax. In my opinion, this is one of the big problems with economic development charts. They don’t focus on what happens in the whole economy.
Tom has a tough time understanding the concept of supply and demand when it comes to labor
No mentioned, but TIF districts are the epitome of socialism/welfare for the rich. Thank you.
Thank you Frank for bringing up TIFs. They are a big problem too. A PS was added to the end of the article.
Numbers are off-
2015 to 2025 - - From 2015 to 2025, the US average inflation rate, measured by the Consumer Price Index (CPI), has fluctuated, with notable increases in 2021 and 2022, and a recent decrease to 2.9% in 2024.
Thank you for the comment. Michael Boskin developed a technique to hide inflation in the 1980s and 1990s. In general terms you add about 7% to the reported rates to get the actual rate. You can find all the details here. https://southdakotavoices.substack.com/p/real-inflation-a-real-worry
By no study I have ever seen comes up with sales tax which includes food is it more fair than property tax.
You are correct, cutting corporate welfare to reduce the burden on middle and lower income people (where most of it is borne) is the most effective tax measure.
Some corporate incentives are good for the public, I agree they can be overdone to a degree of corporate welfare that is bad deal for all but the particular corp. However, my original comment was disagreeing your comment that sales tax was more fair than property tax.
What corporate incentives are good? I believe all of them off them take wealth from taxpayers and give wealth to the corporation.
You explain how sales tax is more fare and I will give you examples of corporate incentives can be for public good.
If you are a South Dakota voice why is your address: 548 Market Street PMB 72296, San Francisco, CA 94104?
Vince is correct. We are located in South Dakota, but use the Substack writing platform. It is located in San Francisco and they put their address on everything. We would be happy to use a South Dakota product, but have not found anything equivalent.
I think it is because substack is a west coast based publishing app. There exist no publishing apps in S Dakota. It would be the same thing as if someone was using gmail. Just because someone might have a gmail account does not mean they are in California.
I know an area in Mexico where many cars have South Dakota license plates, they have South Dakota drivers license . They have never lived here nor do they intend to. Their car insurance is cheaper and South Dakotas taxes for registrations are cheaper. They just go on line and register and no one checks it out.
Sally thank you for letting us know. I believe South Dakota Canvassing, the nonpartisan voting integrity group, is working on this problem. I am not sure they solved the plate or driver's license issue, but I think they might have made some progress in stopping these people from voting in our elections. If you haven't already contacted them with this information, I am sure they would grateful to receive it. @southdakotacanvassinggroup